Oct 192012

Question by Angrylittlegirl: How great of a civilization should one be to be included in a Civilization/Rise of Nations game?
I was thinking about this one day while playing Civ 4. I’ve been wondering how the producers of these games narrow down the 1000+ ancient-to-modern civilizations into 16, 18, or 24.

My mother (who’s formerly a sociology professor) told me that there are factors, but I’m really not quite sure (because she never really loved things about civilization) if these are it:
The Civilization/Nation should:
1. Leave a monumental structure that stood the test of time – or if it was pillaged, at least it had been recorded by the greatest philosophers/historians of the time

2. It occupied a vast territory – I disagreed with her here, Japan isn’t that big, but somehow made an impact in the world

3. It produced the greatest people that ever existed – Plato, Pliny, Aristotle,the Caesars, etc. were great people, that’s why Greco-Roman civilization were included.

4. It must be old – I disagreed with her, the U.S. was included.

5. It must have wone many wars with another country – A-Bomb, Vietcong, Korean War, Alexander’s Indian Defeat, War of 1812, Seven years War, Hundred years war…….but I’m not really sure how that makes a civilization great if it won many wars. Peace advocacy is still a better option.

But I mean, why the Iroquois, or the North American Indians in general? They are barely known in the world. The Nazca lines were shrouded with mystery, but nobody knows about these Nazcas.

The Byzantines aren’t even that unique of a culture. They had emperors alright, but theire armies failed, yet still they’re included.

Or how about the Zulu? Portugal had the same culture/achievement as Spain (I can barely even tell the two countries apart), but it’s included in one of those games. Montezuma failed. Mansa Musa wasn’t recognized by the whole African continent.

I’m not being racist here or anything. I just want to know what the main factors are to be included in these civilization games.

If somehow I (or my mother) was wrong, then please correct us!!!

Best answer:

Answer by Kanien:kaha’ka
i’m Haudenasaunee (iroquois) and i will differ with you on this point. we are known all over the world. in fact, there are many who know more about us than those in the usa since the inclusion of truth about us is not a strong point in your educational systems. we also declared war on nazi germany before the americans did.

we were allied with the british and are still considered by the crown to be allies. the usa constitution is based in large part on our constitution as evidenced by the references made to it by franklin and jefferson among others. the symbolism on the presidential seal is taken directly from our constitution..the eagle and the bound arrows signifying strength in unity. the idea of separate nations (states) with their own laws being under one government (federal) without that larger government usurping powers is from us. the checks and balances of power is from us. we are one of the oldest, true, participatory democracies in the world.

you should read our constitution and see what we accomplished long before europeans got here. our confederacy dates back to the year 1100. of course we existed as separate nations long before that.

the game you are talking about i believe is trying to include civilizations that don’t normally get props. they even attempted to use our language…the first time i think that has ever been done in a video game. as a native speaker i find it funny, since they got the words but their pronunciation is far off, but i appreciate the attempt anyway.

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